Tuesday: It seems like more than ever, fro England and the US especially, that people are ready to come together in the name of forget these politicians, forget politics, it seems like politicians, the career type that give themselves good health insurance and pensions and lifetime pay and garanteed raises.... as they sit there and complain about corporate fat cats??????


They are really no different from the selfish bastards that they want to regulate!

Tuesday: Maybe we should implement that 5% of food stamps be specially designated for splurge items...

Bwild: Thats what I am saying...... they want to make a law for us to be screened for drugs, well, fine let them be screened as well! Same for health insurance.... if its good enough for us, then good enough for them too,

They like their pensions, and want different for us????

There is plenty more...

Artful Dodger: we need them to make it so any law they pass for us, also applies to them, and any law they pass for themselves, also applies to us!

Pedro Martínez: who do you have in mind?

Bwild:

Snoopy:

where is that man anyway?

Übergeek 바둑이:

Czuch: okay, sorry, really...

from english to german to french to japanese to chinese back to english again...

"Somebody here reads the Chinese corona light? "

Pedro Martínez: My translator does not do Czech, I wish it could!

Czuch: okay, last time, I promise....

from english to japanese to chinese back to english..


"Today, anybody here reads the Chinese? "

Czuch: now from english to french to chinese back to english...


"You are good, here, no matter who Chinese does read ?"

Czuch: Now from english to dutch then to chinese then back to english its...


"You are good, here reads everybody Chinese? "

Pedro Martínez: My translator says this

You are good, who whether does here read Chinese?

Pedro Martínez: lol, it started out saying in english "hello, does anyone here read Chinese?"

Bwild: Traditional Chinese......

你好，誰是否這裡讀中文？

Czuch: ....and they got a nobel prize for this work????? Nobels' credibility is really high isnt it?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/environment/article6994774.ece



The science is settled isnt it?????

Übergeek 바둑이: I think you are wrong, in the respect that the type of change most parties claim, is from consrvative ideal to liberal ideals and back and forth.... but Obama was supposed to be different, yes in many respects he was promoting liberal/progressive agenda, but what most people voted for was his promise of a change in the way politics in general were going to be handled.... specifically the more bipartisan, and inclusive and openness blah blah blah....

without that he is just more of the same ol same ol....
he is no different, really, and many of us knew this, but many of us had "hope" and voted on that hope and now they see their errors, and it only took one year for our eyes to become un blind folded......

Thing is that the progressive far left liberals only wanted to move on their socialist agenda, and they thought they had a mandate to do that, unimpeded... but the fact is that their mandate was for a change in how government works and not for their far left agenda


Having said that, I think the same is true for the republicans as well.... people are getting fed up with polics as usual from both sides of the isle, and republicans need to learn this or they will be out as well....


Its time that politicians work for the people who hired them, and in my opinion, that time is very near indeed!

Snoopy: Obama knows that Bush is to blame.... not only for the poorly executed relief efforts, but for the earth quake itself, and for the fact that Bush did not send Haiti money to make their environment more earth quake resistant in the first place!

Did you see on the news..... some of the Massachusetts democrats, they were going to vote democrat until the Kennedys put their noses into things, and they were like "Im not letting them tell me how to vote" , and ended up voting republican instead!


Even Obama tried, even the great persuader could not get it done

1 frickin year, thats all, you couldnt even keep your promises for 1 frickin year

Now the 75% of us uninformed hicks are gonna show you smug SOBs the way to the exits

Übergeek 바둑이: These posts are examples of why you liberals cant hold on to your power.... you are all sooo progressive, and soooo intelligent, and you know what is the best for this country, even though you are about 25% of the population, its just that the rest of us are just poorly educated and uninformed hicks.... and you and Pelosi know whats best, and you will tell us that you are more tolerant and more inclusive and more blah blah blah, but the reality is that you are only more inclusive and more tolerant etc when someone agrees with you or they simply deffer to your superior agenda.....

You know health reform is right, so it doesnt matter that you promised to be more bi partisan, that you promised to have a more open and honest process, no, those promises dont matter because you have self righteousness on your side, you have been given a mandate to cram this down our throat, quick before we lose our super majority, quick before anyone actually has time to digest and understand the true ramifications,... you all make me sick really!


The problem with being so smug and contrite is that you got your power based on telling people how different from that you were going to be, and as bad as you claim Bush was and how different you would be, you turned out worse, simply because you said you were better, no, you promised to be better, and that is a lie that will haunt you for a very long time to come!

What you should have said is that you know what is best and to give us a blank check and we will make everything all right, like the wizard of oz, just leave us alone behind the big progressive curtain, and we will make everything all right, we promise!

Bernice: Now the dems have lost their super majority... and a democrat state like Massachusetts has voted a republican senator to replace Kennedy????


Hey AD, quit acting like a prom girl, and get in her and respond to this......

Bernice: lol... I wouldnt call it a complete disaster.... he and cronies like him have awoken the average person against their so called "progressive" agenda

Snoopy:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1240988/France-tops-list-best-places-live-world-fifth-year-row--Britain-languishes-25th.html


Looks like you have more problems than you care to admit!

You can go on and on about our supposed infant mortality ranking as some sign about the US over all, but seems you need to take a look in the mirror before throwing more stones

Übergeek 바둑이: If it fails, it will be because the Republican party cares more about protecting the business of private insurers than about the lack of adequate care for the poor.


I disagree.... I think it will be because republicans care more about doing something right than what the democrats are willing to do. I live in a state with a couple of the more liberal republicans, who side with democrats way more than I would prefer, and they have never been ones to tote a party line just for that sake, yet they have not been able to back this latest health care plan.


Doesnt it bother you at all that Obama won the election basically because he called for a change in the way politics were run, and more bipartisanship, and openness and all that happy horse crap? This health care law would not take effect for 4 years, whats the rush to pass it like this anyway?

Übergeek 바둑이: lack of adequate care for the poor. Well, the US is the only modern industrialized country without universally available health care.


I am not sure you stated your point the way you meant to?

We already do have universally available health care.... even non citizens can walk into any emergency room and never be turned away services because they dont have the ability to pay for it.

as for the poor having adequate care.... I think if you are very poor you have a better chance to get you health care paid for you than any other income groups.

Übergeek 바둑이: I will go tell all the families who have no dead people, I am sure they will agree with me too!

You can never win this debate, since there is no way for you to prove that the losses would not have been greater had we left the status quo

I know you are smarter than that argument, really? You can always ask the family of a dead person, and they will not agree they like their son dead..... and I can agree on one point, that it is a lot easier to say a cost was worth it, when it isnt your familys life that was part of the cost.

But my point is still valid, we could have spent untold money and time keeping Saddam fenced in, and who knows, still end up having to take him out, and maybe it would cost a lot more if done down the road... maybe saying we got off cheap is wrong, but saying that we got off "cheaper" this way than any other way, how can you say I am wrong?

Übergeek 바둑이: ...and the CBO knows what the total cost would have been keeping him "fenced in" for who knows how many years, and then his sons, and then who knows, maybe some many years down the road, we end up having to go after him anyways, what is that total cost in lives and money?????

My guess is thsat we got off cheap!

BTW, you must be against our recent health care bill? Its funny I dont hear the media or liberals calling Obama a liar over this one, even though the CBO(yes the same trusted CBO that you just quoted) has said that their liberals' numbers are simply lies!

(V): What amount of endless resources were used to "fence" Saddam in? I still believe that taking him out was worth the cost, and that the cost to fence him in would have ended up greater in the long run

Bernice:

(V): so what? Two different fights, Saddam caused us more of a distraction alive than taking him down ever did.

And the point is, that once you have them captured, letting them go makes zero sense.

(V): Only 2???? Thats 2 too many

Artful Dodger: Dont you get it yet???? Neither Bush nor Obama had to react, because they both were the ones to orchestrate the attacks themselves!

Czuch: Okay, now there is witness to some accomplice, who helped this guy get on the plane without a passport..... CIA for sure, and points again to an inside job by Obama

It is obvious to me that this latest "terrorist attack' attempt was nothing more than an inside job by Obama and his neocon cronies, as a rouse to gain more support for their illegal wars on terror!

When are we all going to wake up?

rod03801: Unfortunately, their strategy seems to be, "Let's just get this through, we can unruffle feathers later"


To me it is eerily similar to Bush and the Iraq war.... Most republicans wanted to take Saddam out of power, and they just said and did what they had to, just to get it done and worry about the consequences later

The BIGGEST issue I have right now is that Bam was elected to change this sort of tone and so it is worse now, when the democrats have an issue they want done, no matter the consequences, because they were elected to not be like that!

Just goes to show politics is no different, Bam is no different, democrats are no different, there has not been, nor will there be, change anyone can believe in. The democrats are more frauds than Bush ever was, because they ran on being different, at least Bush never lied to the world like the dems have!

I would love to see the likes of nance Pelosi to be out on term limits and have no benefits and have to then find a real job... it makes me sick, the entitlements that she will have the rest of her life simply for being a representative in our government!!!!

We need to make representing charity work, something someone does to be altruistic, with little or no personal gains involved, then see what happens to that smug smile on Pelosis' face, the one where she knows no matter what she is set for a privileged life simply because she is a representative in our government????

Artful Dodger: I just saw a tv commercial that said "if real people debated the health care bill" in support of the democrats law.....

lmao, it showed a mother with a baby and a doctor and a contractor etc. all telling us "facts" about how great this law will be.... tells me exactly what democrats consider "debate" to be, them telling us what is right for us, and not letting any other opinions to the contrary be heard from!!!

Debate.... yeah right

Nobody wants to talk about our new health care, the one that has to be voted on now, even though it will be 4 years before it goes into effect? Dont bother reading it, or have any chance to amend some late changes, or even the fact that ZERO republicans support it.....


Bam, change we can believe in

(V): Thanks for the link... thats the first time i have seen it, and it more than confirms what I was thinking... the guy was being obstinate, he was purposely obstructing their policing duties, maybe they could have simply wasted more time and effort, and arrested this guy, but they just wanted him to move along, as everyone else was doing.

It is also obvious that this shove in the back is not what killed him, as he got up and walked away on his own afterward... really? If you have contact with the police and end up having a heart attack later, its police murder???

The guy was far from "minding his own business"

btw, here in the US, we respect the police, and once you choose to ignore any command they give you, no matter what your personal feelings are about the command, you obay it, and when you dont, then anything that happens to you after this is all your own fault. You can always after the fact make some action if you think what they did was wrong, but if they tell you to get out of the way, for any reason, you take your hands out of your pockets and you move out of the way

These police will never be charged with murder, as you would have them

Bernice:

(V): How do you know from the video that the police didnt tell him that they were arresting him for obstructing justice, and then he still ignored them, and they were trying to subdue him for arrest?

(V): Not to misuse violence. Not to hit someone then push them to the floor if the person is not causing or in the way of a greater harm.


That is all true.... BUT, the video tape does not tell you anything about that, the video does not tell you if the police thought he was concealing a weapon, or if he was a known suspect, or if he was told to take his hands out of his pockets and move away,.. my instincts tell me that with all the other stuff the police needed to tend to that day, he was obstructing justice, he was the negligent one, who caused his own death because he neglected to follow the direct orders of the police, and if he was still alive, he should be charged with manslaughter for his own death

(V): And the video did show a man with his hands in his pockets being hit and pushed from behind.... since when has that been legal?

Its legal if during a riot, the police command you to show your hands, and to move out of the way.... as far as i know, it is ilegal to disobay any command from a police officer, and they always have a right to force you to comply.

Now if, during this procedure, you have a heart attack, or you bang your head and end up dead, then that is not murder, and it is your own fault you are dead, or it is a coincidence, and you would have died of a heart attack anyway.

I am NOT saying this is what happened, but it is possible that a video doesnt tell the whole story, and like Snoopy said, if it was all as clear, cut and dry, as it appears n the video, then this investigation would have ended long ago, so the length of time it is taking tells me that your first assumption, that it was clearly murder, is WRONG

(V): Gut feeling... instinct. Knowing that something ain't right, or that the police were not telling the truth.

You never said that it was only your opinion that it was murder, you said that it was the police who murdered this poor bloke.... you didnt say that you would like to see an investigation into the incident, because it seemed like a murder to you.... you said it was a clear cut murder,

If you Brits were so into investigations, you would have called for an investigation, but instead, you called it a murder the day it happened

(V): Well, how could you call it murder the day happened, if you are so interested in investigations?

(V): Thats my point.... it was so clear cut murder, with not much investigation needed, was your attitude when it first happened!

If that was the case indeed, it wouldnt take 4 years to sort it out.... my guess is you were wrong